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Flyover removal plan to "open up" town centre

How the new open space to replace Abbey Way flyover, by the fire station, could look. How the new open space to replace Abbey Way flyover, by the fire station, could look.

A MAJOR makeover of High Wycombe town centre has been announced including plans to axe a flyover and re-route traffic to make it more “pedestrian friendly”.

Wycombe District Council wants to close the elevated section of Abbey Way, which connects the Eden and Wycombe Hospital roundabouts for a public space.

The council hopes the nearby Royal British Legion, fire station and Liberal Club will be re-located – to concerns from some owners.

And the long-mooted plans would see traffic routed through the Desborough area by 2014.

Cul-de-sac Westbourne Street would be connected to the A40 via a widened Desborough Road and a new link road through former gas works – earmarked for retail – to a widened Queen Alexandra Road.

The River Wye and Hughenden stream would be “opened up” and a water feature built as part of new public space at the former Abbey Way site, open to local traffic and buses only.

The Eden roundabout would be removed and A4128 Archway, between the roundabout and the railway bridge, would go from a dual to a single carriageway.

Abbey Way is “divisive”, the council argues, and opening it up would create a more “pedestrian friendly” town.

To see a map of the plans click here.

To see read the council’s full document click here. (pdf 3.4MB). You can cross reference codes in the above map to the full details in this document.

It comes after the national Planning Inspectorate watchdog previously said there little evidence to show the flyover plan was achievable – but the council says it can now prove it is.

Planning chief councillor Jean Teesdale said: “I think it is really exciting and imaginative. We want it to be a place where people want to live and work.”

The council said the plan had undergone “extensive transport modelling” but warned congestion would increase unless public transport improved.

Click the links at the bottom of the story for plans for Marlow, Bourne End, Princes Risborough and outer Wycombe areas.

But residents living off Rutland Street said they were stunned by the plan to divert traffic through Debsorough. Angela Reeve, 51, said: “It’s ridiculous.”

Buckinghamshire Fire & Rescue Service said its present location is “currently the best option” and it wanted the ageing station redeveloped.

And legion chairman John Llewellyn said: “We would fight it tooth and nail.”

Yet Liberal Club secretary Alan Grainger said the club “definitely would be interested” in moving. “It could mean an improvement for our members,” he said.

Council planning chief Ian Manktelow said compulsory purchase orders would be a “last resort”.

Council Labour group leader Margaret Draper said she welcomed the “broad sweep” of the plans.

Lib Dem district councillor Trevor Snaith said: "Opening the river is the best thing that could happen. Getting rid of the flyover is long overdue."

Yet he said he was concerned that the fire stations and clubs "may be put under pressure to leave".

Chris Woodman, spokesman for the High Wycombe Society conservation group, said: “It could transform the town and be a tremendous improvement.”

Other proposals include: • Making Queen Victoria Road two-way and allowing Royal Mail and WDC offices to be redeveloped for offices.

• A 150-bed hotel and offices by Wycombe Sports Centre. Cressex park and ride would move to the site, where coaches would stop. Another park and ride would go at Terriers Farm, off Amersham Hill.

• A more “flexible” approach to town centre shop types to meet an “urgent” need to fill empty units.

• Redevelopment of the train station. Chiltern Railways this week made a planning application for a bus interchange, shopping mall, restaurant and cafe and business units. Three parking decks would provide a total 716 parking spaces and extensions to the 1854 broad gauge terminus would be removed.

• Allowing WDC-owned 167-space Duke Street car park to be used for homes or offices with “some” spaces kept.

• Permitting restaurants, pubs, shops and a hotel in the “tired” and “failing” Chilterns Shopping Centre. A hotel plan has already been submitted.

All plans are out to consultation from Tuesday.

To see the council’s maps of all developments click here. (pdf, 19.3MB).

Respond to WDF Consultation, Planning Policy Team, Wycombe District Council, Freepost HY120, Planning and Sustainability WDC 63, Queen Victoria Road, High Wycombe, HP11 1BB. Email spatial_planning@wycombe.gov.uk.

Public meetings and exhibitions on the plans will be held by the council next week.

Comments(42)

am i the only one says...
9:34am Fri 12 Jun 09

More pie in the sky from the council - what are they on ?

Save Wycombe says...
9:37am Fri 12 Jun 09

The flyover is a hideous scar across the town, so I hope it isn't pie in the sky!

Steve Totteridge Hill says...
9:41am Fri 12 Jun 09

Interesting...
There's little thought gone into the A40 through traffic and no mention of how many traffic lights will be needed!

McAvennie says...
9:46am Fri 12 Jun 09

What a waste of money. The town has finally started to come close to some normality and they want to turn it into a building site again for another few years. Not to mention the disruption to traffic this will cause. The flyover is a quick and handy route across the town. This will damage the chances of people coming to Eden if they have a nightmare traffic journey to negotiate. Madness.

SDJones says...
10:09am Fri 12 Jun 09

Wycombe should be made more pedestrian friendly but we all know this idea will take years to build and we all might be dead by then

Townman says...
10:28am Fri 12 Jun 09

How will traffic travel move east to west etc? And when the flyover has gone, what is to stop the Univeristy spreading out to the other side of the road? As is their plan. So many questions to be answered. Shows we need a Town Council to consult over this. This has to be a town decision. Not left to Councillors from other parts of the district, that are NOT effected eg Cllr Teesdale.

parcelman says...
11:09am Fri 12 Jun 09

I agree Townman.

s/w hope-area

wayneo says...
11:30am Fri 12 Jun 09

"The River Wye and Hughenden stream would be “opened up"

Excellent and most fantastic news, there's hope for the town yet!!!

OllieNewbury says...
11:52am Fri 12 Jun 09

Townman wrote:
How will traffic travel move east to west etc? And when the flyover has gone, what is to stop the Univeristy spreading out to the other side of the road? As is their plan. So many questions to be answered. Shows we need a Town Council to consult over this. This has to be a town decision. Not left to Councillors from other parts of the district, that are NOT effected eg Cllr Teesdale.
Now, where have we heard a plan like that before...

Agniesca says...
11:52am Fri 12 Jun 09

The lifeblood of a town is its shoppers. Increase congestion and more shoppers will use out of town alternatives.Is this what we want? I agree that the centre will be more pleasant, but only if it becomes accessable

OllieNewbury says...
12:05pm Fri 12 Jun 09

For some reason, I cannot load the PDF's so I cannot picture this scheme in my mind.

I really cannot see Desborough Road being able to handle cross-town traffic. Abbey Way may not be pretty, but it serves a very useful purpose.

I also don't like the idea of narrowing Arch Way- which can get terribly congested. With the removal of the Eden roundabout, would traffic from Archway have to go onto Oxford Road? I cannot tell. With the new Sainsbury's, I don't think a single-carriageway would cope.

I think the council are putting too much energy into this. I don't want Wycombe to turn into a building site again just to remove a road. If they put half as much energy into more simple things, we could all be swimming in Holywell Mead!

towncryer says...
2:58pm Fri 12 Jun 09

OllieNewbury wrote:
Townman wrote: How will traffic travel move east to west etc? And when the flyover has gone, what is to stop the Univeristy spreading out to the other side of the road? As is their plan. So many questions to be answered. Shows we need a Town Council to consult over this. This has to be a town decision. Not left to Councillors from other parts of the district, that are NOT effected eg Cllr Teesdale.
Now, where have we heard a plan like that before...
Ollie and Townman
we need town council
-- believe there is group pushing for this --we need to get on this group if its ever gonna happen

bakerbill says...
3:08pm Fri 12 Jun 09

Will this be like the improvements the Council have already done like Tens of thousands of pounds wasted on the not working water feature / fountain on frogmore.
Thousands of pounds wasted on concrete balls in Wycombe High Street
So called Improvements to the Handy Cross junction and the large amounts of Money spent on it. which have made it worse and one of the most dangerous roundabouts in this country ,many drivers I know avoid it like the plague , and it still jambs the traffic up . The Bus station reduced to pocket size.
The River Wye completely covered over by Eden shopping centre.
Over £400,000 pounds spent on updating Holywell Mead outside swimming pool wasted , now they have closed it . They have jammed up the town with traffic lights
I could go on and on .
They are like KING MIDAS IN REVERSE

Whatsgoingonthen? says...
4:01pm Fri 12 Jun 09

I was under the impression that the Wye was to be opened up along Oxford Rd when the plans for the Eden were originally submitted.

Whatsgoingonthen? says...
4:11pm Fri 12 Jun 09

WDC are not great at long-term planning are they? How about they leave the town alone and invest in helping small businesses stay in town and reduce the amount of empty shops/offices.

OllieNewbury says...
5:22pm Fri 12 Jun 09

bakerbill wrote:
Will this be like the improvements the Council have already done like Tens of thousands of pounds wasted on the not working water feature / fountain on frogmore.
Thousands of pounds wasted on concrete balls in Wycombe High Street
So called Improvements to the Handy Cross junction and the large amounts of Money spent on it. which have made it worse and one of the most dangerous roundabouts in this country ,many drivers I know avoid it like the plague , and it still jambs the traffic up . The Bus station reduced to pocket size.
The River Wye completely covered over by Eden shopping centre.
Over £400,000 pounds spent on updating Holywell Mead outside swimming pool wasted , now they have closed it . They have jammed up the town with traffic lights
I could go on and on .
They are like KING MIDAS IN REVERSE
Wasn't the Handy Cross re-build payed for and planned by the Highways Agency? I don't WDC contributed any cash at all.

But I agree with your other points.

wycombenewbie says...
7:32pm Fri 12 Jun 09

This is a great vision.

That flyover is a horrid divide of the town centre and the removal of it will open up some much need green space closer to the shops than the Rye. Burying that river was one of the worst things to happen in Wycombe, so this is an excellent decision to bring it back to the surface and make the most of it. currently even the surface part between the legion and the swan isn't particularly nice.

I'm sure there always going to be some people upset by these plans, most though will see that this is for the long-term benefit of the town.

smiley cat says...
7:39pm Fri 12 Jun 09

bakerbill wrote:
Will this be like the improvements the Council have already done like Tens of thousands of pounds wasted on the not working water feature / fountain on frogmore. Thousands of pounds wasted on concrete balls in Wycombe High Street So called Improvements to the Handy Cross junction and the large amounts of Money spent on it. which have made it worse and one of the most dangerous roundabouts in this country ,many drivers I know avoid it like the plague , and it still jambs the traffic up . The Bus station reduced to pocket size. The River Wye completely covered over by Eden shopping centre. Over £400,000 pounds spent on updating Holywell Mead outside swimming pool wasted , now they have closed it . They have jammed up the town with traffic lights I could go on and on . They are like KING MIDAS IN REVERSE
LOL

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good rant!!!


Dear dear...

aug69 says...
7:48pm Fri 12 Jun 09

And still sod all about frogmoor. spend a few bob there.its not like it doesnt need it.Its probably a good indicator of how this pipe dream will end up.Lots of ideas and all of them wrong

faisal mahmood says...
7:59pm Fri 12 Jun 09

wayneo wrote:
"The River Wye and Hughenden stream would be “opened up"

Excellent and most fantastic news, there's hope for the town yet!!!
The powers that be read Ivor blogs!


Have you read the idiots blog today just click on your say and blogs*

ivor says...
8:50pm Fri 12 Jun 09

It seems the powers that be are listening to me as only the other week I was calling for the re-opening of the rive Wye.

Previously I have called for the removal of the Oxford Road roundabout.

Of course this misses the big issue which is the re-development of Frogmoor and the installation of a proper fountain there.

I have seen the artist’s impression (in the pictures above) and there does seem an awful lot of concrete in the design. Maybe they should consider putting some grass or flower beds in the design to make it more friendly?

Have you read Ivor’s blog today? Click on the “YOUR SAY” link at the top of the page then click on “BLOGS”.

am i the only one says...
9:00pm Fri 12 Jun 09

Ivor, do you work for the council, and is this your idea ?

Plus ça change... says...
9:10pm Fri 12 Jun 09

wayneo wrote:
"The River Wye and Hughenden stream would be “opened up" Excellent and most fantastic news, there's hope for the town yet!!!

I think they listening to us, Wayneo...

Ivor, it is just a general artistic impression at this stage...

smiley cat says...
9:38pm Fri 12 Jun 09

ivor wrote:
It seems the powers that be are listening to me as only the other week I was calling for the re-opening of the rive Wye. Previously I have called for the removal of the Oxford Road roundabout. Of course this misses the big issue which is the re-development of Frogmoor and the installation of a proper fountain there. I have seen the artist’s impression (in the pictures above) and there does seem an awful lot of concrete in the design. Maybe they should consider putting some grass or flower beds in the design to make it more friendly? Have you read Ivor’s blog today? Click on the “YOUR SAY” link at the top of the page then click on “BLOGS”.
LOL

And that is all I am prepared to say about this egotistical fool.

Because no one else has called for the opening of the Wye have they?
Oh and I am quite sure that these plans have been years in the planning -not as the result of reading some numpties ramblings 2 weeks ago.

J B Blackett says...
10:13pm Fri 12 Jun 09

I support wholeheartedly the comments from

bakerbill
Savewycombe
Townman
Wayneo
Agniesca
Plus ca change
Wycombenewbie
AND yes even Ivor

Sorry (smiley_cat and Ollie N)

It is Interesting News , but will it ever happen in our lifetime ? It apparently took nearly 40 years to make a final decision on the Newlands area.

Politics and vested interests combined equals stagnation and inertia , I'm afraid (viz Tescos and their ilk)

Townman also makes a very valid point that a proper Town Council, involving the citizens and burghers of the town itself , is critical
It is absolutely necessary that for a proper and legitimately acceptable scheme that is satisfactory to everybody affected should involve local people at all stages.

Not a few distant uncaring politicians and their flunkies.

Regards to all

smiley cat says...
10:25pm Fri 12 Jun 09

All I am commenting on is that Ivor thinks it's cos they read his blog lol!
I have no strong feelings one way or the other!

OllieNewbury says...
11:13pm Fri 12 Jun 09

J B Blackett wrote:
I support wholeheartedly the comments from

bakerbill
Savewycombe
Townman
Wayneo
Agniesca
Plus ca change
Wycombenewbie
AND yes even Ivor

Sorry (smiley_cat and Ollie N)

It is Interesting News , but will it ever happen in our lifetime ? It apparently took nearly 40 years to make a final decision on the Newlands area.

Politics and vested interests combined equals stagnation and inertia , I'm afraid (viz Tescos and their ilk)

Townman also makes a very valid point that a proper Town Council, involving the citizens and burghers of the town itself , is critical
It is absolutely necessary that for a proper and legitimately acceptable scheme that is satisfactory to everybody affected should involve local people at all stages.

Not a few distant uncaring politicians and their flunkies.

Regards to all
It just seems a lot of work, but now that the PDF's can open for me, I'm beginning to see how it would work.

But I still would like Archway to remain dual-carriageway.

Some may remember my petition a few months ago which called for greater independence for the town.

ivor says...
4:32am Sat 13 Jun 09

As part of the new development I wonder if they will put some doors on the complex and fix the holes in the roof where the rain comes in?

Have you read Ivor’s blog today? Click on the “YOUR SAY” link at the top of the page then click on “BLOGS”.

smiley cat says...
9:24am Sat 13 Jun 09

ivor wrote:
As part of the new development I wonder if they will put some doors on the complex and fix the holes in the roof where the rain comes in? Have you read Ivor’s blog today? Click on the “YOUR SAY” link at the top of the page then click on “BLOGS”.
Er no....

because it was never intended to be a closed in shopping centre - never.

sai-diva says...
2:57pm Sat 13 Jun 09

I was at a meeting over a year ago when the re routing of the A40 was proposed,the question I asked then was, how're they going to widen desborough? It wont be by knocking down that lovely new church, so watch out all you businesses on that road.
As for getting rid of the flyover, I'd love to see that, but as it will require the co-operation of county council,and Wycombe's planning dept. all I can say is,don't hold your breath.

wayneo says...
10:07pm Sat 13 Jun 09

Plus ça change... wrote:
wayneo wrote: "The River Wye and Hughenden stream would be “opened up" Excellent and most fantastic news, there's hope for the town yet!!!
I think they listening to us, Wayneo... Ivor, it is just a general artistic impression at this stage...
I think they are plus,If they do it right, I for one will come back to the town for shopping and recreation.

wayneo says...
10:31pm Sat 13 Jun 09

What I am not happy about though, is that this pillocks in Council have allowed the building of houses on Kingsmead (REF:KR1)

They have also allowed a new hotel at the sports centre (MU19), these pillocks have also allowed over 2000 new houses to be built within the Wycombe area. Where the hell is the traffic going to go?

THERE IS NO MORE ROOM AT THE INN!!!!

TheT0nemeister says...
1:21pm Tue 16 Jun 09

sai-diva wrote:
I was at a meeting over a year ago when the re routing of the A40 was proposed,the question I asked then was, how're they going to widen desborough? It wont be by knocking down that lovely new church, so watch out all you businesses on that road. As for getting rid of the flyover, I'd love to see that, but as it will require the co-operation of county council,and Wycombe's planning dept. all I can say is,don't hold your breath.
I think they will probably just put 10 sets of traffic lights along the length of the flyer as they are still trying to get rid of the bulk buy lot they have used everywhere else round the town center.

Low_Wycombe says...
9:10pm Tue 16 Jun 09

For once Buckinghamshire County Council have done their research; according to the film Back To The Future 2 by the year 2015 we will be driving flying cars.

In the words of the Doc Emit Brown, “Roads? Where we’re going we don’t need roads”

Spitfire says...
9:13am Wed 17 Jun 09

I think it's a great idea to open up free space in the town and move the traffic further out of the centre. I wonder if people here are objecting to the plans or just the fact they've been made by a Tory council.

Plus ça change... says...
8:32am Thu 18 Jun 09



Still not sure what the two piles of blue 'set squares' are?

Any ideas?






Plus ça change... says...
2:36pm Thu 18 Jun 09

Spitfire wrote:
I think it's a great idea to open up free space in the town and move the traffic further out of the centre. I wonder if people here are objecting to the plans or just the fact they've been made by a Tory council.

Spitfire!

I think I saw you the other day...

Flying over Wycombe with another fighter ...?

On your way to Walters Ash?

Was that you?



wigwam54 says...
4:45pm Thu 18 Jun 09

and the circus rolls on the fire station are spending £60,000 on refurb and new doors completion date August has no one told them about this!

feyaz says...
6:33pm Sat 20 Jun 09

this is ridiculous, in traffic it already takes 20-40 min to drive from one side of town to the other. there is no where that the amount of traffic that uses the flyover can go to. it's another waste of tax payers money. reading all the negative comments to the plan on here makes me wonder why we are not all in charge of the council. if only we could vote out the crazy planning officers from our concil

Plus ça change... says...
10:07am Fri 26 Jun 09


I saw something wonderful in Wycombe today...

Something almost miraculous.

Something that portends the future!












A small bus.


bakerbill says...
8:02pm Mon 29 Jun 09

feyaz wrote:
this is ridiculous, in traffic it already takes 20-40 min to drive from one side of town to the other. there is no where that the amount of traffic that uses the flyover can go to. it's another waste of tax payers money. reading all the negative comments to the plan on here makes me wonder why we are not all in charge of the council. if only we could vote out the crazy planning officers from our concil
I totally agree with feyaz .And when they remove the flyover lots of the shops in the old Octagon will have no roof .Is this a dastardly cleaver plan by the Council to reduce the number of shops in the town because 40% are unoccupied and unrentable .

what_an_odd_town says...
10:39pm Wed 8 Jul 09

I thought that the Wye was meant to be 'opened up' (uncovered) when the new shopping centre Eden was built? I have had occasion to visit twice now and still not yet seen it; has it remained covered after all? It is lovely to see it either side of the Morrisons supermarket. I do hope the old library and the Liberal club are to remain in situ in any further town re-vamp - it would be a shame if they were to be destroyed in the name of 'progress' of the town. Whatever happened to the Dove, the proposed arts centre that many of raised funds for about 30 years ago? Thousands were raised, wonder where all the money went . . .

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